MrNomNoms
Mar 26, 03:57 AM
I use my computer as a "real computer" and I like virtually every change I've seen. I wish people wouldn't generalize so broadly and presume that because certain additions aren't something that they use that it has nothing to do with "real work."
Why shouldn't they be related? Borrowing concepts and sharing library isn't the same as being merged. The only people who honestly believe the OSes are being merged into one are the paranoid people on this forum.
Unless I'm missing something, Mission Control is added in addition to Expos� as it is now. The old functionality will still be there. As for it being "ruined," a couple of days before the Lion preview the graphic artist I work with most was describing changes he wished they'd make to Expos� and we were laughing together a few days later when we watched the preview and boom, there it was. Incidentally, he makes his living off what he does with his "real" computer.
Cool. Don't use "full screen apps." However, they make a lot of sense in a few places. Paired with Spaces I'm looking forward to this when working on my laptop without an external monitor. Also, on a multimonitor setup it makes a lot of sense.
Again, don't do any of it. I've been using Steam for my games on the PC basically since CounterStrike: Condition Zero was released. It's awesome. I was thrilled with the AppStore for similar reasons. It's just convenient. However, it's not the only distribution method available for software so its existence doesn't impede you.
I also use my trackpad when using my computer like a desktop and love having my Expos� gestures there.
What's being dumbed down exactly? Ease of use is very different than "dumbing down." Workflows that aren't what one particular individual likes are not "dumb." There are plenty of UNIX fanatics that think people using anything but CLI for half their workflow are using "dumbed down" interfaces. They're wrong and they're annoying.
Launchpad is, in my opinion, the lamest and most unnecessary addition to Lion. However, it's so minor that I don't care. I know some people will really like it. I am not personally offended by the inclusion of a feature I don't use or care about either.
The vast majority of people using computers are not techies, pros or developers. They're people like my parents. As a developer, I'm generally more excited about a new release of XCode than I am about OS X because overall, it's going to affect what I do far more than the OS will.
If they merge in the sense that the Mac becomes as locked down as an iPhone, I agree that that's it on Macs and even if they don't die in the market from Apple's would be hubris I'll be leaving Apple for something else. Thankfully, this will only occur if most of Apple's leadership is replaced with an army of complete morons.
Really, my point is this: you don't have to like these features. However, that doesn't mean they're not useful. It doesn't mean that they're "dumbed down." It doesn't mean "pros" won't like them. It doesn't mean people who like them don't use their computer as a "real computer" and instead treat it as a "toy." It means you don't like them.
Thank you for your constructive reply but I have a feeling it will all fall on deaf ears given that most have never actually gone on Google and researched what has been added/changed/enhanced to Mac OS X Lion. For example SAMBA has been removed and completely replaced with a ground up clean room implementation of SMB2 which will translate into better support for Windows Vista and 7 clients as well as the latest versions of Windows. Why hasn't that been mentioned by the nay sayers here?
OpenGL 3.2 has been added and funny enough not a single thing has been said about the fact that it lays the foundation for future updates that will be more prompt.
Then there is Webkit2 based web browser whose knock on effects go well beyond Safari and into applications wishing to utilise web based technologies with framework that provides said functionality but handles all the mundane security/process isolation/etc behind the scenes.
The merging of AV Foundation that serves as the foundation for future development for media products that will span iOS and Mac OS X; that you can have the same media core on iOS and Mac OS X then build upon it to differentiate between the desktop and tablet version by having a different interface, more features on the desktop version etc.
Sandboxing is being enhanced further and more system components are being put into it as to reduce the security exposure when a bug is found.
I'm sure others can note even more enhancements but it is frustrating when I hear the same nauseating ignorance over and over again from the cheap seats screaming there are no new features and yet they've done zero in the way of researching and reading on the matter.
Why shouldn't they be related? Borrowing concepts and sharing library isn't the same as being merged. The only people who honestly believe the OSes are being merged into one are the paranoid people on this forum.
Unless I'm missing something, Mission Control is added in addition to Expos� as it is now. The old functionality will still be there. As for it being "ruined," a couple of days before the Lion preview the graphic artist I work with most was describing changes he wished they'd make to Expos� and we were laughing together a few days later when we watched the preview and boom, there it was. Incidentally, he makes his living off what he does with his "real" computer.
Cool. Don't use "full screen apps." However, they make a lot of sense in a few places. Paired with Spaces I'm looking forward to this when working on my laptop without an external monitor. Also, on a multimonitor setup it makes a lot of sense.
Again, don't do any of it. I've been using Steam for my games on the PC basically since CounterStrike: Condition Zero was released. It's awesome. I was thrilled with the AppStore for similar reasons. It's just convenient. However, it's not the only distribution method available for software so its existence doesn't impede you.
I also use my trackpad when using my computer like a desktop and love having my Expos� gestures there.
What's being dumbed down exactly? Ease of use is very different than "dumbing down." Workflows that aren't what one particular individual likes are not "dumb." There are plenty of UNIX fanatics that think people using anything but CLI for half their workflow are using "dumbed down" interfaces. They're wrong and they're annoying.
Launchpad is, in my opinion, the lamest and most unnecessary addition to Lion. However, it's so minor that I don't care. I know some people will really like it. I am not personally offended by the inclusion of a feature I don't use or care about either.
The vast majority of people using computers are not techies, pros or developers. They're people like my parents. As a developer, I'm generally more excited about a new release of XCode than I am about OS X because overall, it's going to affect what I do far more than the OS will.
If they merge in the sense that the Mac becomes as locked down as an iPhone, I agree that that's it on Macs and even if they don't die in the market from Apple's would be hubris I'll be leaving Apple for something else. Thankfully, this will only occur if most of Apple's leadership is replaced with an army of complete morons.
Really, my point is this: you don't have to like these features. However, that doesn't mean they're not useful. It doesn't mean that they're "dumbed down." It doesn't mean "pros" won't like them. It doesn't mean people who like them don't use their computer as a "real computer" and instead treat it as a "toy." It means you don't like them.
Thank you for your constructive reply but I have a feeling it will all fall on deaf ears given that most have never actually gone on Google and researched what has been added/changed/enhanced to Mac OS X Lion. For example SAMBA has been removed and completely replaced with a ground up clean room implementation of SMB2 which will translate into better support for Windows Vista and 7 clients as well as the latest versions of Windows. Why hasn't that been mentioned by the nay sayers here?
OpenGL 3.2 has been added and funny enough not a single thing has been said about the fact that it lays the foundation for future updates that will be more prompt.
Then there is Webkit2 based web browser whose knock on effects go well beyond Safari and into applications wishing to utilise web based technologies with framework that provides said functionality but handles all the mundane security/process isolation/etc behind the scenes.
The merging of AV Foundation that serves as the foundation for future development for media products that will span iOS and Mac OS X; that you can have the same media core on iOS and Mac OS X then build upon it to differentiate between the desktop and tablet version by having a different interface, more features on the desktop version etc.
Sandboxing is being enhanced further and more system components are being put into it as to reduce the security exposure when a bug is found.
I'm sure others can note even more enhancements but it is frustrating when I hear the same nauseating ignorance over and over again from the cheap seats screaming there are no new features and yet they've done zero in the way of researching and reading on the matter.
bommai
Apr 7, 10:19 PM
Wow. I bought mine at Best Buy on opening day and they sold out of them. Why in anybody's right mind would best buy not sell what they have?
d0minick
Mar 26, 10:41 AM
Question, as all my previous macs were used, I recently purchased the new macbook pro 2011 line and a refreshed Air. Will I be able to get Lion at a discount for the recent purchase or do I pay full price? I was just wondering. Thanks!
Yamcha
Apr 19, 02:41 PM
The First Commercial GUI
http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/5659/star1vg.gif
Xerox's Star workstation was the first commercial implementation of the graphical user interface. The Star was introduced in 1981 and was the inspiration for the Mac and all the other GUIs that followed.
http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/7892/leopardpreviewdesktop4.jpghttp://img714.imageshack.us/img714/5733/xerox8010star.gif
http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/5659/star1vg.gif
Xerox's Star workstation was the first commercial implementation of the graphical user interface. The Star was introduced in 1981 and was the inspiration for the Mac and all the other GUIs that followed.
http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/7892/leopardpreviewdesktop4.jpghttp://img714.imageshack.us/img714/5733/xerox8010star.gif
ugp
Jun 10, 12:46 PM
I don't think any Radio Shack sales people know what a transistor is.
You got questions? We have cell phones.
Why would they? Not many people buy them anymore.
In the 7 years I worked at RadioShack we didn't get much business for parts and when we did it was for the stuff we didn't carry. I think Fuses are the only things we sold often from those parts drawers. And it was always the same people coming in for parts anyways.
You got questions? We have cell phones.
Why would they? Not many people buy them anymore.
In the 7 years I worked at RadioShack we didn't get much business for parts and when we did it was for the stuff we didn't carry. I think Fuses are the only things we sold often from those parts drawers. And it was always the same people coming in for parts anyways.
inhrntlyunstabl
Apr 27, 10:05 AM
And once again people give Apple a pass for something that is clearly an issue.
You mean to tell me that Apple...this sounds like something Google would do, not Apple.
revelated, beware! Apple is closing in on you with their black helicopters and vans to take you prisoner for mind control experiments.
OR
If they did this on purpose, maybe they wanted to know why so many people complain about AT&T in certain parts of SF. Or maybe they wanted to know how many users access Internet via all the Starbucks in the world? Maybe they wanted to direct ads at you based upon your location.
All of the above are already being done to you via many other avenues, e.g. your frequent buyer cards, ATMs, CCs, etc.
BUT
If you want to believe there is some BIGGER MYSTERIOUS PURPOSE in mind for them to do this, you go right on.
LOOK OUT BEHIND YOU - WAS THAT A BLACK UNMARKED VAN!!!! :D
You mean to tell me that Apple...this sounds like something Google would do, not Apple.
revelated, beware! Apple is closing in on you with their black helicopters and vans to take you prisoner for mind control experiments.
OR
If they did this on purpose, maybe they wanted to know why so many people complain about AT&T in certain parts of SF. Or maybe they wanted to know how many users access Internet via all the Starbucks in the world? Maybe they wanted to direct ads at you based upon your location.
All of the above are already being done to you via many other avenues, e.g. your frequent buyer cards, ATMs, CCs, etc.
BUT
If you want to believe there is some BIGGER MYSTERIOUS PURPOSE in mind for them to do this, you go right on.
LOOK OUT BEHIND YOU - WAS THAT A BLACK UNMARKED VAN!!!! :D
sjo
Aug 11, 04:09 PM
I have three subscriptions. Two in europe, one in US. How does that count?
Yeah, I've got several as well, if I spend more than two weeks in another country or visit there frequently I tend to get local subscription. Much more convenient to stay connected with the locals. This way I help more and more countries to get over the 100% treshold as well :rolleyes:
Yeah, I've got several as well, if I spend more than two weeks in another country or visit there frequently I tend to get local subscription. Much more convenient to stay connected with the locals. This way I help more and more countries to get over the 100% treshold as well :rolleyes:
4God
Jul 14, 02:35 PM
... and the other one HD-DVD! :eek: ;) :D
Doh! Well, again IMHO, it is my preference to have only one optical drive built in. I could always add an external later.
Doh! Well, again IMHO, it is my preference to have only one optical drive built in. I could always add an external later.
PBF
Apr 11, 11:11 PM
I think everyone making the (pretty much insane) comments that this spells the end of the iPhone's dominance should wait and see what iOS 5 looks like and how the iPhone 5 takes advantage of it.
Hmm, I wonder on what device they will preview iOS 5.
They can't really say something like "...and these awesome groundbreaking features will work even better on iPhone 5", can they? :rolleyes:
Hmm... :rolleyes:
Hmm, I wonder on what device they will preview iOS 5.
They can't really say something like "...and these awesome groundbreaking features will work even better on iPhone 5", can they? :rolleyes:
Hmm... :rolleyes:
bryanc
Sep 19, 07:14 AM
Does it even MATTER if Apple keeps up? Do we actually WANT Apple to release a new computer every month when Intel bumps up their chips a few megahertz?
....
Is it really hurting you guys that Apple has been slow to update? Are you really doing tasks that the current computer lineup cannot do?
Actually, yes. I use my laptop as a portable desktop, and I do a lot of different things with my computer. My current PowerBook G4 is capable of some of them, but really not practical for many (scientific computing, ray-tracing molecular models, etc.). A current yonah-based MBP would certainly be faster, but it would still be a 32-bit processor, and like many other pro-users, I don't want to have to buy a new machine every year.
So I'm waiting for the merom-based MBPs like thousands of others, because I'm going to need that 64-bit CPU, and I want the extra speed (note that, even if you're not using the 64-bit CPU's capacity to address vast amounts of memory - not possible in a current laptop anyway - when in 64-bit mode, the CPU has more registers, making it significantly faster than when it runs in 32-bit mode).
I rather hoped that Apple would be first out of the gate with these new CPUs, but their delay getting to market with Intel's latest laptop chip makes me cautiously optimistic that we may see it appear in a redesigned case (with easily swappable HDDs please).
Cheers
....
Is it really hurting you guys that Apple has been slow to update? Are you really doing tasks that the current computer lineup cannot do?
Actually, yes. I use my laptop as a portable desktop, and I do a lot of different things with my computer. My current PowerBook G4 is capable of some of them, but really not practical for many (scientific computing, ray-tracing molecular models, etc.). A current yonah-based MBP would certainly be faster, but it would still be a 32-bit processor, and like many other pro-users, I don't want to have to buy a new machine every year.
So I'm waiting for the merom-based MBPs like thousands of others, because I'm going to need that 64-bit CPU, and I want the extra speed (note that, even if you're not using the 64-bit CPU's capacity to address vast amounts of memory - not possible in a current laptop anyway - when in 64-bit mode, the CPU has more registers, making it significantly faster than when it runs in 32-bit mode).
I rather hoped that Apple would be first out of the gate with these new CPUs, but their delay getting to market with Intel's latest laptop chip makes me cautiously optimistic that we may see it appear in a redesigned case (with easily swappable HDDs please).
Cheers
grue
Apr 11, 06:29 AM
Well, I can say this much:
I don't care if they change the interface, because if the new version doesn't fix the LONGSTANDING issues with FCP, my post house is dumping FCP and moving to Avid and I'll have to get used to a new interface anyway.
Sick of bad file handling, sick of flawed roundtripping, sick of crappy multicore support, sick of flaky-as-hell Qmaster, sick of stupid little idiosyncrasies that make sense to nobody I've ever spoken to in the industry.
Apple needs to get their crap in gear or they're going to lose a lot of their FCP install base, not many places are happy with it anymore. I'm sure the idiot fanboys will buy it no matter what, but people like myself (who actually make a living and want reliable, efficient software) are ready to leave.
I don't care if they change the interface, because if the new version doesn't fix the LONGSTANDING issues with FCP, my post house is dumping FCP and moving to Avid and I'll have to get used to a new interface anyway.
Sick of bad file handling, sick of flawed roundtripping, sick of crappy multicore support, sick of flaky-as-hell Qmaster, sick of stupid little idiosyncrasies that make sense to nobody I've ever spoken to in the industry.
Apple needs to get their crap in gear or they're going to lose a lot of their FCP install base, not many places are happy with it anymore. I'm sure the idiot fanboys will buy it no matter what, but people like myself (who actually make a living and want reliable, efficient software) are ready to leave.
YoGramMamma
Apr 6, 03:02 AM
I've posted several predictions over the past few months throughout this tread at Cinema5D:
http://cinema5d.com/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=25464
Dude I took the time to read that entire post on cinema5d and I have to tip my hat to you. You have clearly thought this out. Hopefully someone at apple saw this post and is making notes! IMO (and clearly in yours) this is very much what apple needs to do. This content store idea is brilliant, makes apple more bucks, and allows content creators a way to make money on the selling end, and benefit from well made content on the receiving end. It turns videographers and photographers and motion graphic designers into "developers" ... Just without the need to know objective-C. I like it a lot. Have you tried submitting these ideas to Apple?
The idea of downloading just the core objects and have all the other stuff being in-app purchases is also brilliant and tying everything to your appleID too, since it'd let you legally install stuff on up tot 5 machines. Why I use up almost 60gb of stuff for "soundtrack loops and Dolby surround files" is beyond me.
Also this alleviates the whole final cut express/pro distinction. Essentially, fce is just fcp without any of the extra apps / plugins downloaded.
http://cinema5d.com/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=25464
Dude I took the time to read that entire post on cinema5d and I have to tip my hat to you. You have clearly thought this out. Hopefully someone at apple saw this post and is making notes! IMO (and clearly in yours) this is very much what apple needs to do. This content store idea is brilliant, makes apple more bucks, and allows content creators a way to make money on the selling end, and benefit from well made content on the receiving end. It turns videographers and photographers and motion graphic designers into "developers" ... Just without the need to know objective-C. I like it a lot. Have you tried submitting these ideas to Apple?
The idea of downloading just the core objects and have all the other stuff being in-app purchases is also brilliant and tying everything to your appleID too, since it'd let you legally install stuff on up tot 5 machines. Why I use up almost 60gb of stuff for "soundtrack loops and Dolby surround files" is beyond me.
Also this alleviates the whole final cut express/pro distinction. Essentially, fce is just fcp without any of the extra apps / plugins downloaded.
b166er
Apr 7, 10:34 PM
me too! I wanna learn!
How does withholding stock from the public aid a company? I can imagine holding them till everything is registered in their system and accounted for. But turning people away when they actually do have stock doesn't sound like a good business practice to me
When you are as HUGE as best buy, and you are selling a product as huge as the iPad, it makes sense to create a demand. People do this all the time. You can't get it now, so the second it becomes available to you, you buy it in fear that you might have to wait another month. This happens all the time with a lot of products.
How does withholding stock from the public aid a company? I can imagine holding them till everything is registered in their system and accounted for. But turning people away when they actually do have stock doesn't sound like a good business practice to me
When you are as HUGE as best buy, and you are selling a product as huge as the iPad, it makes sense to create a demand. People do this all the time. You can't get it now, so the second it becomes available to you, you buy it in fear that you might have to wait another month. This happens all the time with a lot of products.
Heilage
Mar 1, 12:01 AM
Heterosexual couples need to reserve sex for opposite-sex monogamous marriage. If I had a girlfriend, I might kiss her. But I wouldn't do that to deliberately arouse either of us. If either of us felt tempted to have sex with each other, the kissing would stop right away. I know of a woman who gave an excellent answer when men asked her why saved sex for marriage. She said, "I"m worth waiting for." She lived by her Catholic convictions, and she wouldn't risk letting any man use her as a mere object, as a mere tool.
n.
You can condemn me to Hell if you want to, I'm still gonna bump uglies with my girlfriend.
On another note, please join us in the 21st century. Why is it so important to you what other people do? Wouldn't it be very crowded in Heaven if everyone did as you said?
n.
You can condemn me to Hell if you want to, I'm still gonna bump uglies with my girlfriend.
On another note, please join us in the 21st century. Why is it so important to you what other people do? Wouldn't it be very crowded in Heaven if everyone did as you said?
studiomusic
Apr 5, 11:09 PM
Already have my tickets... I was looking forward to Kevin Smith and Philip Bloom, but FCP is a welcome announcement.
Hopefully they'll give a bunch of copies of it for the Supermeet Super Raffle.
Hopefully they'll give a bunch of copies of it for the Supermeet Super Raffle.
Thomas Veil
Apr 28, 05:46 AM
I lost it a long time ago. Trump is an asshat that should just shut the **** up and go back to diddling eastern european models and building casinos (is that christian right compliant I wonder?).But of course today, instead of looking embarrassed and admitting he was wrong, he's "taking credit" for something. Not sure exactly what.
aristotle
Apr 6, 04:10 PM
Real tablet OS, Full internet, True multitasking - the list's expanding fast :D
Define "Real Tablet OS" considering that Honeycomb is just an extension of Android with some new UI controls. That means that Honeycomb is no "more" of a tablet OS than iOS and Apple stated that iOS started out on a prototype tablet before being shrunk to a phone.
selena gomez and justin bieber
Justin Bieber and Selena Gomez
Define "Real Tablet OS" considering that Honeycomb is just an extension of Android with some new UI controls. That means that Honeycomb is no "more" of a tablet OS than iOS and Apple stated that iOS started out on a prototype tablet before being shrunk to a phone.
Blue Velvet
Mar 22, 10:21 AM
I was stewing about this
Honestly, don't bother. You think facts count for anything? One simple pointed observation about Ronald Reagan was enough to stop the flow of nonsense in its tracks. Congress hasn't declared war since the mid-1940s... funny how that's so important all of a sudden now.
As for the ill-advised juvenile rant about liberals and 'their' first black president, I think it's far better that sort of comment is left intact for others to read. The full workings of the conservative id are plain to see.
Honestly, don't bother. You think facts count for anything? One simple pointed observation about Ronald Reagan was enough to stop the flow of nonsense in its tracks. Congress hasn't declared war since the mid-1940s... funny how that's so important all of a sudden now.
As for the ill-advised juvenile rant about liberals and 'their' first black president, I think it's far better that sort of comment is left intact for others to read. The full workings of the conservative id are plain to see.
nevir
Sep 19, 12:15 PM
My demanding you to give me a reason has about the same weight as all the people in this thread (and many others) demanding Apple provide them with the machine they think they needed yesterday.
It's more along the lines of "We see all these other laptop manufacturers releasing new CPU's in their products. We see that Apple has already recieved these chips. We feel that it is extremely likely that Apple's laptop lines will be updated with these CPU's, and soon. Finally, We don't want to buy a product that will be outdated in just a month or two.
Of course, there's those who have been waiting for more than a couple months. For those, they are looking to 'future-proof' their machine, somewhat. If you notice, more or less every new CPU model that will be coming out is 64-bit, and there's no doubt that developers will write apps that take advantage of that architecture in the coming years. So why buy a computer that has a lower likliehood of supporting all the software you'd like to run over it's lifetime?
As for "needing it yesterday", that is a product of the hype; but I think, for the most part, we feel that the laptops could have been ready earlier - and certainly would have liked Apple to have come out and said "MBP updates soonish" (of course that makes no business sense for clearing inventory though).
It's more along the lines of "We see all these other laptop manufacturers releasing new CPU's in their products. We see that Apple has already recieved these chips. We feel that it is extremely likely that Apple's laptop lines will be updated with these CPU's, and soon. Finally, We don't want to buy a product that will be outdated in just a month or two.
Of course, there's those who have been waiting for more than a couple months. For those, they are looking to 'future-proof' their machine, somewhat. If you notice, more or less every new CPU model that will be coming out is 64-bit, and there's no doubt that developers will write apps that take advantage of that architecture in the coming years. So why buy a computer that has a lower likliehood of supporting all the software you'd like to run over it's lifetime?
As for "needing it yesterday", that is a product of the hype; but I think, for the most part, we feel that the laptops could have been ready earlier - and certainly would have liked Apple to have come out and said "MBP updates soonish" (of course that makes no business sense for clearing inventory though).
MacsRgr8
Aug 5, 04:02 PM
Me excited too! :)
I've made plans with some ex-colleagues to follow the event live using the text-based coverage made available.
Let me thank MacRumors : Live already!
It'll be 6 pm over here, so we'll be ready with some pizzas and cokes! ;)
Then once I get home a couple of hours later, I can watch the stream! :cool:
I've made plans with some ex-colleagues to follow the event live using the text-based coverage made available.
Let me thank MacRumors : Live already!
It'll be 6 pm over here, so we'll be ready with some pizzas and cokes! ;)
Then once I get home a couple of hours later, I can watch the stream! :cool:
mmmcheese
Nov 28, 09:09 PM
Anyone who didn't see this coming is a complete idiot...
AidenShaw
Sep 15, 09:53 AM
More pedantic details for those who are interested... :).
Any description of the history of NT that doesn't say "Mica" and "Prism" is missing some major details ;) !
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DEC_PRISM
Any description of the history of NT that doesn't say "Mica" and "Prism" is missing some major details ;) !
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DEC_PRISM
ergle2
Sep 15, 12:50 PM
More pedantic details for those who are interested... :)
NT actually started as OS/2 3.0. Its lead architect was OS guru Dave Cutler, who is famous for architecting VMS for DEC, and naturally its design influenced NT. And the N-10 (Where "NT" comes from, "N" "T"en) Intel RISC processor was never intended to be a mainstream product; Dave Cutler insisted on the development team NOT using an X86 processor to make sure they would have no excuse to fall back on legacy code or thought. In fact, the N-10 build that was the default work environment for the team was never intended to leave the Microsoft campus. NT over its life has run on X86, DEC Alpha, MIPS, PowerPC, Itanium, and x64.
IBM and Microsoft worked together on OS/2 1.0 from 1985-1989. Much maligned, it did suck because it was targeted for the 286 not the 386, but it did break new ground -- preemptive multitasking and an advanced GUI (Presentation Manager). By 1989 they wanted to move on to something that would take advantage of the 386's 32-bit architecture, flat memory model, and virtual machine support. Simultaneously they started OS/2 2.0 (extend the current 16-bit code to a 16-32-bit hybrid) and OS/2 3.0 (a ground up, platform independent version). When Windows 3.0 took off in 1990, Microsoft had second thoughts and eventually broke with IBM. OS/2 3.0 became Windows NT -- in the first days of the split, NT still had OS/2 Presentation Manager APIs for it's GUI. They ripped it out and created Win32 APIs. That's also why to this day NT/2K/XP supported OS/2 command line applications, and there was also a little known GUI pack that would support OS/2 1.x GUI applications.
All very true, but beyond that -- if you've ever looked closely VMS and at NT, you'll notice, it's a lot more than just "influenced". The core design was pretty much identical -- the way I/O worked, its interrupt handling, the scheduler, and so on -- they're all practically carbon copies. Some of the names changed, but how things work under the hood hadn't. Since then it's evolved, of course, but you'd expect that.
Quite amusing, really... how a heavyweight enterprise-class OS of the 80's became the desktop of the 00's :)
Those that were around in the dim and distant will recall that VMS and Unix were two of the main competitors in many marketplaces in the 80's and early 90's... and today we have OS X, Linux, FreeBSD, Solaris, etc. vs XP, W2K3 Server and (soon) Vista -- kind of ironic, dontcha think? :)
Of course, there's a lot still running VMS to this very day. I don't think HP wants them to tho' -- they just sent all the support to India, apparently, to a team with relatively little experience...
NT actually started as OS/2 3.0. Its lead architect was OS guru Dave Cutler, who is famous for architecting VMS for DEC, and naturally its design influenced NT. And the N-10 (Where "NT" comes from, "N" "T"en) Intel RISC processor was never intended to be a mainstream product; Dave Cutler insisted on the development team NOT using an X86 processor to make sure they would have no excuse to fall back on legacy code or thought. In fact, the N-10 build that was the default work environment for the team was never intended to leave the Microsoft campus. NT over its life has run on X86, DEC Alpha, MIPS, PowerPC, Itanium, and x64.
IBM and Microsoft worked together on OS/2 1.0 from 1985-1989. Much maligned, it did suck because it was targeted for the 286 not the 386, but it did break new ground -- preemptive multitasking and an advanced GUI (Presentation Manager). By 1989 they wanted to move on to something that would take advantage of the 386's 32-bit architecture, flat memory model, and virtual machine support. Simultaneously they started OS/2 2.0 (extend the current 16-bit code to a 16-32-bit hybrid) and OS/2 3.0 (a ground up, platform independent version). When Windows 3.0 took off in 1990, Microsoft had second thoughts and eventually broke with IBM. OS/2 3.0 became Windows NT -- in the first days of the split, NT still had OS/2 Presentation Manager APIs for it's GUI. They ripped it out and created Win32 APIs. That's also why to this day NT/2K/XP supported OS/2 command line applications, and there was also a little known GUI pack that would support OS/2 1.x GUI applications.
All very true, but beyond that -- if you've ever looked closely VMS and at NT, you'll notice, it's a lot more than just "influenced". The core design was pretty much identical -- the way I/O worked, its interrupt handling, the scheduler, and so on -- they're all practically carbon copies. Some of the names changed, but how things work under the hood hadn't. Since then it's evolved, of course, but you'd expect that.
Quite amusing, really... how a heavyweight enterprise-class OS of the 80's became the desktop of the 00's :)
Those that were around in the dim and distant will recall that VMS and Unix were two of the main competitors in many marketplaces in the 80's and early 90's... and today we have OS X, Linux, FreeBSD, Solaris, etc. vs XP, W2K3 Server and (soon) Vista -- kind of ironic, dontcha think? :)
Of course, there's a lot still running VMS to this very day. I don't think HP wants them to tho' -- they just sent all the support to India, apparently, to a team with relatively little experience...
Yamcha
Mar 26, 04:00 PM
I'm looking forward to it, but what would be really amazing if on the next major release of Mac OS they add support for running .EXE files. I know there are third party applications out there to do that, but If it could be legally done and done properly where we don't see any major performance hits then it would truly be the end of using Windows for me, and I'm sure for most others..
I think that would be awesome.. But I know probably unlikely..
I think that would be awesome.. But I know probably unlikely..
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